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Ardern and other former ministers refuse to appear in public before Royal Commission

Author
NZ Herald,
Publish Date
Wed, 13 Aug 2025, 3:18pm
Former Prime Minister Dame Jacinda Ardern, pictured during the Covid-19 pandemic. Photo / Andrew Warner
Former Prime Minister Dame Jacinda Ardern, pictured during the Covid-19 pandemic. Photo / Andrew Warner

Ardern and other former ministers refuse to appear in public before Royal Commission

Author
NZ Herald,
Publish Date
Wed, 13 Aug 2025, 3:18pm

The second set of public hearings for the Covid-19 Royal Commission has been axed after key witnesses, including former Prime Minister Dame Jacinda Ardern, refused to appear.

Those witnesses, including Labour leader Chris Hipkins and former ministers Grant Robertson and Ayesha Verrall, continue to co-operate with the inquiry.

The National-led coalition Government decided in June last year to establish a 鈥減hase two鈥 of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Covid-19 Lessons, to take place after the completion of the original inquiry set up under the previous Labour Government.

Chair Grant Illingworth has the power to summons people to appear before the inquiry, but said he would not use it on Ardern and the other ministers.

鈥淥n balance we are of the view that a summons is undesirable, given that the former ministers continue to co-operate with the evidence-gathering of the inquiry.

Grant Illingworth KC, chair of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into the Covid-19 pandemic response, is leading the investigation into how the government managed the crisis. Photo / Covid 19 inquiry via RNZ
Grant Illingworth KC, chair of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into the Covid-19 pandemic response, is leading the investigation into how the government managed the crisis. Photo / Covid 19 inquiry via RNZ

鈥淚t is our opinion that the use of summonses to achieve their participation at a public hearing would be legalistic and adversarial, which our terms of reference prohibit,鈥 Illingworth said.

He said he still believed public hearings would enhance public confidence in the inquiry鈥檚 processes by enabling the public to see former ministers 鈥 who have critical insights into the pandemic response 鈥 questioned in public.

A minute, published by the inquiry, recorded the objections of Ardern and the other ministers.

These objections included the convention that ministers and former ministers are interviewed by inquiries in private, and departing from that convention would undermine confidence.

They were also concerned that the livestreaming and publication of recordings of the hearing creates a risk of those recordings being 鈥渢ampered with, manipulated or otherwise misused鈥, a risk which the inquiry 鈥渙ught to have foreseen and planned for鈥.

Other witnesses raised concerns that providing evidence at public hearings might bring risks of abuse being directed at them and their families.

This afternoon, Hipkins affirmed he was not hiding from the hearings.

鈥淲e have shown up to the enquiry, I have shown up to the enquiry. I have been interviewed by them twice,鈥 he told reporters during a standup.

鈥淚 have provided written evidence to the enquiry, I answered every question they had and I attended the interview they scheduled for me.

鈥淭hey asked for two hours, but they ran out of questions after an hour.鈥

Hipkins said he did not coordinate his approach with Ardern.

鈥淪he is still a very close friend of mine. We have people representing us in common, but any suggestion we colluded with this is wrong.鈥

He said it was inappropriate for him to speak on behalf of Ardern.

鈥楧eserve the basic respect of accountability鈥

National MP Chris Bishop accuses Hipkins of running from his record.

鈥淔resh from fobbing off Treasury鈥檚 report into Labour鈥檚 spending, [he] is avoiding accountability by refusing to front up to the Royal Commission,鈥 he said.

鈥淏y first dismissing Treasury鈥檚 report and now refusing to front, Chris Hipkins is telling New Zealanders he does not care about the effects his decisions have had on Kiwis.鈥

Deputy Prime Minister David Seymour said Ardern, Verrall and Hipkins鈥 refusal to publicly appear before the commission was a change from 鈥渋nvading our living rooms daily鈥.

鈥淗ipkins and co loved the limelight at 1pm every day. They wielded extraordinary powers over citizens鈥 lives, dismissing those who questioned them as uncaring. Now they鈥檙e refusing to even show up, what a contrast,鈥 he said.

鈥淭ens of thousands of New Zealanders have already engaged with the inquiry, sharing experiences of how their lives were upended.

鈥淭hey deserve the basic respect of accountability,鈥 Seymour said.

鈥楥onspiracy theorist views鈥

Last month, in a brief statement, a spokesperson said Ardern will provide evidence to assist the commission 鈥渋n meeting its terms of reference鈥.

鈥淲e are in discussions about the best way for this to occur.

鈥淪he is also happy for the commission to access her previous testimony from RC1 [Commission of Inquiry first stage].鈥

Hipkins, appearing on Herald NOW last month, said he had issues with the way the second phase of the Royal Commission had been set up, particularly the decision to exclude from consideration the years that NZ First was governing with Labour.

鈥淭he fact that the [Royal Commission] terms of reference specifically exclude decisions made when NZ First were part of the [Labour-led coalition] Government 鈥 I think the terms of reference have been deliberately constructed to achieve a particular outcome, particularly around providing a platform for those who have conspiracy theorist views.

鈥淭hat seems to have been specifically written into the terms of reference that they get maximum airtime.鈥

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